Software and hosting options for PF2

EDIT:

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I've set up a site on PlushForums. I like it. Have a look, create an account, try it out:

http://thephilosophyforum.com/

Note: if you're anything like me you'll want to zoom the site to 125% or more by pressing ctrl+ twice.

For $49/month we get:

200 members online at the same time.
600 simultaneous guest users.
Unlimited pageviews.
20GB storage.

Looks good to me. This seems like the nicest and easiest option.
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So are you people up for a PF2? Paul seems outwardly hopeful about PF1, but I don't want anything to do with a site owned by Mr Porat. So assuming there's a niche to fill here, and assuming nobody steps in to set up PF2 in something like the old form...

I fear this Forumotion thing isn't a good permanent platform for PF2, so I've been looking at other options.

Software

1. Discourse: http://www.discourse.org/
   
2. NodeBB: https://nodebb.org/
   
3. Vanilla: https://vanillaforums.com/
   
4. Muut: https://muut.com
   
5. PlushForums (hosted only): https://plushforums.com/
   
6. Flarum (self-hosted only): http://flarum.org/
   

A few of these have demos. Try them out. Discourse and NodeBB will appeal to the bleeding-edgers among you, Vanilla more to the traditionalists.

I set up free trials on Muut and Vanilla. I don't think these are the best of the bunch, but feel free to join and play around:

http://philosophy.vanillacommunity.com/
https://muut.com/philosophy

Hosting

1. Hosted

Discourse, NodeBB, Muut, Vanilla and PlushForums have hosted plans. This means that we just sign up and bingo, we've got a home. No need for any server administration. The question is cost. My feeling is that it would likely end up more expensive than a self-hosted forum, but it would be easier to maintain, and backups would be automatic. We'd just have a bit less control, e.g., new features would not be easy to introduce.

I see that Muut offers unlimited users, traffic and posts, and a custom domain, for $36/month, which seems a lot cheaper than the others.

2. Self-hosted

For this option we have to run the software ourselves on our own server, VPS or cloud platform. We'd have to install and set up the software. I have a couple of VPSs running and one isn't being used much, but it would take some time to get it into shape. (EDIT: in fact if we went this route I'd just set up a new one). Or there are cloud-hosting options that offer a quicker route to live, like Bitnami, which actually has a quick setup package for a Discourse server, and all you need is an Amazon AWS account, and I've got one of those already.

Whichever option we chose I could set up some kind of donations thing as in PF1.

I don't know how much time I'm going to have to work on this project, though I'd definitely love to do it. I'm just throwing around ideas at this stage.

Yes, as long as Porat is in charge, I'm up for a PF2. Much appreciate your work on this. Will check these out.

jamalrob wrote:

I fear this Forumotion thing isn't a good permanent platform for PF2, so I've been looking at other options.

What specific problems are there with the present platform? I like it because it's simple, although it does seem a bit slow at times, and maybe there are significant technical issues, I wouldn't know.

Muut and Vanilla both seem fine to me too.

baden511 wrote:Yes, as long as Porat is in charge, I'm up for a PF2. Much appreciate your work on this. Will check these out.  

I'm also up for a PF2, as long as Porat is in charge of it. But do you think jamalrob will be willing to step aside and allow him to take over?

I also like vanilla and muut. Not sure which I prefer.

I've set up a site on PlushForums. I like it. Have a look, create an account, try it out:

http://thephilosophyforum.com/

Note: if you're anything like me you'll want to zoom the site to 125% by pressing ctrl+ twice.

For $49/month we get:

200 members online at the same time.
600 simultaneous guest users.
Unlimited pageviews.
20GB storage.

Looks good to me. This seems like the nicest and easiest option.

That looks good to me.

I can't say much regarding how it is setting this up or the tech issues involved, but I can say if it is set up as similar as possible to the current PF site, that is... in terms of particular Forums and sub-Forums, this would make any transition easier.

A similar (familiar) set up simply makes it easier to navigate; thus makes it appealing to those who have to adapt to something new who are not as tech savvy or tech interested.

In know that's getting a bit ahead of the game, but too many changes makes things difficult or frustrating (sort of like the fall of communism and many people shortly there after thinking the good ol' days were a lot better).

Somehow the change from PF to this 'new PF' will be (for many) enough change for a little while.  

Meow!

GREG

I hear you, but this was only meant as temporary. If we're going ahead with PF2 I'd like to move us all across as soon as possible.

As for layout, functionality and navigation, again I hear you, but habit and familiarity are not great reasons to maintain the old structure. A simpler structure is going to be easy to deal with. You can see how simple it can be in the PlushForums site I just linked to. I think we should use the old category titles though.

To be honest, I could follow it within minutes, so that says something about just how easy it is to use.

I tend to have very creative solution for things that make little sense. How I get my YouTube links posted is difficult to believe. Especially since I lead the Forums in YouTube links.

True story of a computerly impaired user:

I had a computer with no brackets keys. I have no idea why...

... anyway.

I couldn't figure out the icons to do this, so I would open someone else's post in the plain editor and cut & paste their YouTube link into my post. Then I'd copy the YouTube address and paste it in place whatever was in the YouTube link I copied from someone else.

In spite of getting a computer with the proper keys, I have done it this way (out of habit) for all of the 1000's of YouTube non-sequiturs I have posted in PF over the past 6+ years.

My IT friends just look at me in disbelief at many times, but I usually find my way in spite of my complete ignorance of how to do it properly.

Meow!

GREG

Just tried posting youtube videos. It's a doddle: http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/6/youtube-video-test-especially-for-the-mayor

jamalrob wrote:Just tried posting youtube videos. It's a doddle: http://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/6/youtube-video-test-especially-for-the-mayor

Thanks!  

I had a bit of a shock at first, as I noticed this under the video:

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua.

For a brief moment I though there must be a 'dyslexia activation' key on that new site.

Meow!

GREG

Haha, no, just my standard cut and paste placeholder text.

Now that jamalrob has set up the new forum he can sell this one.

Moved.

Personally, I feel if you plan on creating a new PF. I think you should shoot very high on the newest best websites. I understand this costs money. I don't know how much I could donate towards the cause or how much you guys intend on donating to make this happen. I just feel that the old PF probably will not be going away anytime soon. Even so... If it does, I don't think the majority will leave. ( I don't know your intentions) but I am somewhat positive if you have a low end website you will only attract your close PF buddies 10-20 members frequently.

In my early days, I used to play a first person shooter game called Counter Strike. I hosted my own server after a while and its tough as hell to keep it populated for any amount of time and even harder to keep regulars. Just because, there where other more popular servers to choose from and my server though was fast. Nice fps. It was not the FASTEST. These days, to draw people you need the newest best thing out there (my opinion.) Go big or go home. That is my idea. I would love for you guys to succeed in this. Again, I don't know what your main goals are. But, if you are planning on creating a new PF that is just has big. To get that empire you will need to bring more to the table then Zeal and hard work. You will need to make the old PF look like a cheap pair of sneakers compared to this new Nike Air Jordans (site).

You can also work towards advertisement. Not on the site but to bring in traffic by making your spot on Google higher and using facebook and twitter among other outlets towards recruiting like minded people. If you guys are all in on this idea then promoting on the old PF will probably end up getting you banned. So, I would side cautiously there.

Anyways, thats my two cents. I just thought I would chime in.

jamalrob wrote:
I've set up a site on PlushForums. I like it. Have a look, create an account, try it out:

http://thephilosophyforum.com/

Note: if you're anything like me you'll want to zoom the site to 125% by pressing ctrl+ twice.

For $49/month we get:

200 members online at the same time.
600 simultaneous guest users.
Unlimited pageviews.
20GB storage.

Looks good to me. This seems like the nicest and easiest option.

Like the clean, non-distracting look.
Seems to have all the requisite usual functionality (maybe not colors, not sure).
Don't know how well it scales, and how easy it is to navigate with lots of posts, but might be easy enough.

Uh so moving again?

The speed people set up new working forums... and people move to them tell a lot of PF crowd, not only how far the net/social media has gone.

I see that Muut offers unlimited users, traffic and posts, and a custom domain, for $36/month, which seems a lot cheaper than the others.

Just wanted to clarify a bit: Muut offers unlimited users, traffic, and posts for free, and you can also embed it on your own site at no cost.